#There's going to be a LOT that needs to be solved when Salem and the Gods are defeated

[foulfirerebel]

What role do you think ghira, ilia and the new white fnag will play in the vacuo arc? Besides having cute reactions to bumblby being a thing now.

I hope they don’t do a repeat of what happened at haven where the “good Faunus” save the racist humans so all the Atlesians have a “change of heart”. The last thing this show needs is more respectability politics lol.

Put of everyone ilia seems the most likely to tell the Atlesians to their face that they brought this upon themselves for their complacency in atlas many MANY societal injustices without trying to sugarcoat it.

Simply put? Helping to arm and aid Faunus who can fight, while aiding in taking care of those who cannot. Remember: there's not been a gathering of people this big since the olden days of Ozpin and Salem, so there's going to be MASSIVE tensions between every nation.

But of course, that's not all. The New White Fang is going to need to be one of the lines of aid and defense for the combined forces, and people are NEED to accept their help. I can see them telling off some racist asshat Atlesians who complain about how the "animals" are talking back now and threatening to leave them in the desert or something if they don't accept things as they're moving.

Also, just one other thing about Haven. The choice there was either leave the kingdom itself to die, not just the school, or go and help them. It took the Belladonnas nearly being assassinated and Blake's speech to get some Faunus to WAKE UP about the situation.

And if some people STILL want to cause problems? They can do so in the harsh, unforgiving desert sands. There's too much at stake to cater to racists, and since the show itself has shown our protagonists shutting them down and basically that their ideas don't matter or deserve time in the long run? I don't see any respectability politics being used at this point.

Mistral is arguably a work in progress for now, but Vacuo? Shit, the Atlesians and Mistralians are going to be lucky that Vacuoans don't rip them a new one BEFORE or ALONGSIDE the Faunus. I say this because Atlas and Mistral both drained Vacuo dry of resources following The Great War.

So. Calming the tensions or resolving them between nations is going to be...interesting, to say the least. I don't see The New White Fang prioritizing Atlas citizens (unless they're Faunus, were already poor, etc.) that decide to keep their horrible attitudes intact after everything its done to the world and the Faunus.

This isn't saying I'm wanting fights to break out or people killed, just the tensions to be a factor at this point. Old wounds reopening, a lot of social injustices being called out, the imperialism, colonialism, racism, you get the idea.

Any sort of division at this point only aids Salem, so this is going to be interesting to see how it's resolved. I do like that Ruby's message convinced so many to come to Vacuo. The world tensions aren't going to be solved overnight, but at least they can start by helping defend the kingdom.

TLDR: I want the NWF to help Faunus across the nations, and to be helping defend Vacuo alongside others. I'd also like them to be keeping tensions low, shutting down the racists, and proving to Salem how wrong she was to underestimate and discount Faunus.

The citizens of Atlas have lost their kingdom, homes, and livelihoods. I'd like at least one of the NWF to rub salt in the wound by calling them out on things the nation did, but they'd be one of many doing that. People of Vale would want answers for the Fall of Beacon, Vacuo for the colonialism of both Mistral and Atlas, and Mistral for their lack of support following Beacon's fall.

It doesn't mean that I think all citizens of Atlas necessarily deserve to be treated like dirt, but there's a lot the nation needs to answer for when all is said and done. In the meantime, ensuring people are able to defend themselves and taking no shit from the more bigoted of people from there will absolutely be a good start.

[invested-in-your-future]

Why do you think RWBY v1-3 worked compared to the rest of it?

Hm.

Honestly a lot of the first three volumes doesn't - the pacing can be awful (and grinds to a halt within arcs dealing with Jaune), the writing decisions leave a lot of to be desired(and are beyond offensive at times).

To say what the first three volumes do well is to talk about what the volumes after dont.

The issue with V4 and onward is simple one:

Too many new redundant characters

I have been hammering on this point again and again - in a weird attempt to expand the world, the showrunners ended up filling it with things that overlap win purpose or outright have no purpose.

Generally if you want to have something happen and want to choose between existing character and new character as initiator, nine times out of ten it's better to go with an existing character.

For example, why did we need Salem's evil council of evil? Why did we need a whole team of villains on Salem's side that essentially fulfill same role and purpose as Cinder's group already did? They don't exactly do anything for the lore or the setting and most of their purpose is one-note - Hazel for example exists just to rage about Ozpin in a poorly executed attempt at making his intentions and role more ambiguous - but there are already plenty of characters who can fill that purpose, so why was Hazel, as a character made? Raven exists, Ironwood exists and is clearly having a crisis, even Haven's headmaster exists (let's say he does) - plenty of ways other characters can fulfill the same purpose as Hazel without Hazel existing. Same extends to the rest of Salem's group - Watts exists solely to "explain" the computer virus (why did we need it explained?) and to have a reason to go against Atlas (but Cinder already has a reason thanks to her backstory in-show???) and Tyrian is the same way.

Too many redundant story beats

The writing attempted to make the setting more complex, but in the end a lot of what's added has no real reason to be there - why do we need Relics when Maidens are already there? Even if we were to go with the same idea of Gods causing doomsday(as dumb as it is) the writing could just as easily have the exact same plotline with collecting Maiden powers, for example. So why have vaults and then relics on top of that?

The Gods are the same way too. Why have Gods at all when you can already comfortably just go with the idea of Salem getting Maidens powers to her side being just as catastrophic? Salem's backstory doesn't even need them - in fact if one were to remove the Gods and keep the backstory the same, the end result would be exact same story. But the show doesn't do that - instead, come V9, it adds ANOTHER layer of gods and magic trees and gives the god brothers a backstory that ALSO wasn't needed and doesn't do ANYTHING in terms of furthering the narrative.

Generally if there's a plot thread you'd want to do the first question to ask would be "Does this change ANYTHING for any of the characters?" - plot is an excuse to get characters through the story beats after all. In the case of God Brothers, the plot thread invents a new problem and then solves it - nothing changes.

Lost Focus

The show is titled RWBY for a reason.

Ruby, Weiss, Blake, Yang - that's the core of the show.

The show started with the color trailers focusing on them and their journeys. The Volume 3 ended with them each having their own issues to deal with and plot threads tying to those issues.

What do the Volumes that follow do with that set-up? Nothing.

Volume 4 is absolutely pointless in grand scheme of things.

Volume 5 is absolutely pointless in grand scheme of things.

Volume 6 is absolutely pointless in grand scheme of things.

In fact, I wrote about the story structure issues with V4 years ago

The narrative structure, at the basic level, is a game of Connect-the-Dots - you have specific story beats you want to reach that work in accordance with overall story and character outline - it's up for The Plot(tm) to lead the characters from one beat to the other.

The way RWBY works past V3 is by inventing a new problem that didn't and then resolving it, essentially staying in place. I sort of outlined it in the V4 structure chart in my write up in how nothing in that Volume serves any real purpose nor furthers the characters.

What does the mess at Haven Academy contribute to the story story that Beacon already haven't? Does what happen there affect the story going forward? No.

What does team RWBY and the whole absolutely dumb and boring mess with the mech and leviathan do for the story? Are there any lasting consequences from that happening? Nope.

What does the run-in with the Apathy do for the characterization? Are there any lingering psychological effects? Do we learn something new about how Grimm function or how the Eyes work? Are there any lingering implications or any story holes that the encounter slots in into? Absolutely nothing.

That's three big examples in those Volumes where the writing invents a new issue, resolves it and doesn't further characters or narrative by doing so.

In Connect-the-Dots, you don't stop hopping from dot to dot midway-through, you don't hop back and forth between existing dots. Story beats and character beats are beats for a reason - they move things forward, they affect things, they alter things. If you have something that leads the narrative back at the place it was before in then you might as well delete the entire thing.

Now this is not the same as characters being stuck in loops or the idea of repetition as storytelling device - repetition that the narrative is aware of WOULD be a story beat in on itself and this is not that.

In fact even going into Atlas arc - the endgame has almost nothing to do with the build up to it and would happen anyway even if most of the volumes leading to it were removed.

Anticlimactic Payoff

If the narrative is build up to something, the pay off should generally equal to the amount of time and focus spend on the build up (unless it's used as a contrast).

Yet in RWBY a lot of mysteries end up being more of matter-of-fact answers than revelations.

What happened to the moon? Oh something crashed into it.

Why are Ozpin and Salem the way they are? Gods did it.

Why is Raven angry at Ozpin? He...turned her into a bird?

What has been Raven up to? Nothing.

Is Ozpin shady or not? Eh, not really - he's just sort of there.

What's up with the creatures of Grimm? Gods did it.

All of these were teased and built up going forward and the actual revelations never justified the build up or teasing that came before.

None of those revelations did anything to further the narrative or develop characters.

It was as if the writers were going through a checklist of what needs to be revealed.

So, What about the first three Volumes?

Now, flip everything I wrote about V4 and onward upside down.

That's the first three Volumes.

The only characters that exist are the ones that have an use within the narrative.

The plot threads are revealed when they become relevant - Mt.Glenn comes up when it matters, for example. If anything there's not enough reveals.

One can easily trace the plot threads through the story - how Ruby's introduction to Beacon affects her dynamics with Weiss, how Jaune's and Ruby's struggles with unexpected positions of leadership affect the team formation, how the friction within the teams furthers the plot to crash into villains goals. And what's more - each mini-arc ties to the four leads and their characterization. Things don't just happen - each storyline starts with the character and ends with characters growing or their relationships changing.

The Payoff is extremely good - V3 takes every single thing the show did through the three volumes and makes use of it. Everything matters - Mt. Glenn exposition, Roman, WF stuff, Jaune's insecurities, Pyrrha's characterization, Yang's characterization, Blake's conflict, Ruby's growth and position int he story, Weiss growth, etc - everything gets used and everything affects the characters involved.

For all the flaws, for all the absolutely insensitive story decisions and bad jokes - the first three volumes manage to handle those key points well and the end result is far more enjoyable.

The volumes after don't.

While good action sequences helped one of many reasons I hold V1 through V3 dear to my heart is because the show pulled off something that was quite rare back then when those Volumes aired - delivering actual consequences and not being afraid of upsetting the status quo within the story.

[bestworstcase]

Question from someone who's attempting to write rwby fanfiction. Do you have any advice on how avoid portraying team RWBY and their peers (JNPR, Penny, Oscar, etc) as people who are 'just better' or somehow more inherently virtuous than Those Evil Villains Over There Who Must Be Defeated and The Failures Of Generations Past? Because I want to write the girls and their friends bringing an end to a millennia-long conflict and upending the status quo and yeeting the brother gods, but like. I don't want to somehow imply that they have some special holy righteous sacred innate thing that made them succeed where others couldn't. And I feel like I keep accidentally implying that.

step 1. Worry Less.

if you don’t believe that RWBY et al are intrinsically Just Better Somehow you’re probably not going to write your story in a way that inadvertently implies as much even if they’re ultimately the ones who Solve The Problem. they’re just in the right place at the right time to escape this cycle these things happen bfrgk

step 2. remember that everybody does what they think is right

no one is a Bad Person on purpose and even when someone does something they know or believe to be wrong there is always some rationalization going on that makes it okay or makes it something outside of their control. keeping this in mind whenever you write character conflict is really important for portraying conflict in a naturalistic way—even if it isn’t something you put In The Text it’s useful for you as a writer to know what’s Going On in the heads of the characters who are wrong and why they’re doing the things that they do.

(a good exercise if you want to practice is to rewrite a scene from the other side’s point of view; if you have for example an argument between two characters who are both extremely convinced of their own rightness and don’t like each other, can you leap into the antagonist’s perspective and write that argument from their side in a way that paints the protagonist as irrational, stubborn, foolish? if you can switch your writer POV around like that to see things from the Wrong Perspective it becomes a lot easier to handle complex conflicts because you have a really solid grasp on what everyone’s stakes and opinions and reasons are.)

step 3. don’t be afraid to let the Good Guys fuck up & don’t be afraid to let the Bad Guys have a point

rwby does this really really really well. nobody is ever one hundred percent completely right—not in the story and not in real life—so letting the good guys be a little bit wrong and the bad guys be a little bit right creates points of common ground and margins for compromise to be built in between. and obviously if you have protagonists who are able to make mistakes and grow and accept compromise then Innately you have protagonists who are flawed and three dimensional, because if they were Perfect they wouldn’t need to learn or grow.

step 4. think about Why these characters are the ones who solve the problem

this is something that’s just helpful to have in mind as a writer to clarify your own framing; often the answer is a lot more about circumstance than any intrinsic Betterness and in the case of rwby a lot of it just comes down to the fact that salem attacked when she did—team rwby et al weren’t inculcated into the paranoid keeping secrets cult and didn’t have ozpin to lead them, so they figured out their own way of doing things that (because it plays to humanity’s strengths) works a lot better.

y’know how every time someone new is let in on the secret, the first question they ask is “why don’t people know? why not tell everyone?” the story is making the point that the natural, instinctive human response to finding out about a secret war is to go “it shouldn’t be secret!”—ozpin has to work very hard and be extremely careful about Who he initiates into this conspiracy because his methods run contrary to human nature. it takes active effort to quash that reflex to ask for help. what makes team rwby et al "special" isn’t anything unique to them, per se; its that they learnt the truth outside of this coercive environment that trained the old guard to Never Tell Anyone, so they intuitively grasp that telling more people and asking for help is better than not. because Most People put into this situation would intuitively grasp that.

[eastwindmlk]

“You’re wrong.” A voice came from behind James, taking him by surprise. The point of his pencil was almost going through the newspaper. His head whipped around to see an unfamiliar face peering at him from between the seats behind him. “Uh, thank you? But I am pretty sure about this one.” He muttered, too confused to question the woman. His eyes drifted back to his crossword. “Suit yourself, but you are wrong.” She chirped, disappearing back into her seat without offering what she believed to be the right answer. Which suited James just fine. He did not need help to solve it.

A few minutes went by, and the train halted at the next station. A chilly breeze was going through the car as people bustled in, shaking snow from their heads and shoulders before settling into a spot. Tapping at the next clue that stumped him, his lips rubbing together in thought. Pressing them together, the lady behind him appeared again. “You are thinking of the wrong type of season.”

James turned a quarter so he could see her properly, wondering what type of person would feel the need to meddle in his puzzling time. He was not sure what he was expecting, but it was not a set of brilliant green eyes framed with thick lashes. Red-painted lips, wearing a knowing smile. So, at least she was cute. Not that it made what she was doing less rude.

“What makes you say that?” He asked before having thought over whether he really wanted an answer. “You’re thinking food seasoning, but you’re doing the Times crossword.” James nodded. So far, she was right. Taking off his glasses to polish them, he thought over her words, a smile creeping onto his face. “Fall. It is bloody fall.” He realised, pushing his glasses back up his nose. Looking at the woman for confirmation, he felt oddly proud when she nodded, withdrawing once more.

Another station passed them by; he finished his crossword in peace before turning to stare out of the window. The afternoon skies were already dark grey, and he was watching street lights fly past. “You’re a long way from home; what brings you to Scotland?” James asked, seemingly out of the blue, having the urge to engage the lady behind him in conversation. There was a long pause, thinking that maybe she hadn’t heard him. Or he had assumed he had not been talking to her, which made sense. Turning in his seat, peering along the gap in chairs, he offered her a smile.

The green eyes stared back at him, a little baffled. A paperback copy of Salem’s Lot being lowered. “Huh?” The lady blinked at him, her head cocking slightly. “You’re not from around here, are you? So, why are you heading to Edinburgh?” He tried again, feeling a little less confident than he had moments ago. The smile on his face turned more awkward the longer he persisted. “Am I wrong?”

“No, no, you’re not. South London, born and raised.” She smiled, and the book was now closed on her lap. “I’m here for a conference. Speaking at one, actually.” James watched her hands wring together for a moment before she tucked a lock of hair behind her ear. “Sorry, I did not mean to make you uncomfortable. I severely underestimated how long a four-hour train ride actually is.” he hoped that being honest would put her at ease a little.

“You’re right! Four hours is forever on a train!” Her laugh reassured him a little, making her seem less nervous. “What about you? Because you don’t sound very northern either.” Now it was James’s turn to laugh and shrug. “Same, actually. But I am recruiting.” She hummed, nodding slowly, before extending her hand. “Lily Evans, pleasure to meet you.” Reaching over the seat to shake her hand, he smiled. “James Potter, pleasure is all mine.”, “Say, there is a very empty seat next to me and about two more hours. I think my masseuse will murder me if I keep sitting like this.”

And like that, she was sitting next to him. The two hours melted away like it was nothing. He learned they were going to the same conference. As well as having similar tastes in music, films, and food. She bought them a drink in the dining car, and he produced an entire roll of chocolate cookies from his bag. When the train pulled into Waverley station, it signalled the end of their journey. Pulling on his gloves, James contemplated asking for her number or her card. Anything.

But Lily beat him to it. “So, second date tonight? Dinner?” A question he did not have to think twice about. Nodding maybe a little too eagerly. “Meet me at the ticket booth at six.” It wasn’t until she was already halfway down the platform that he wondered why she had called it a second date. A question he was sure to ask her that night.

[howlingday]

Oh ok so I'm about lore dump one of the most important for my Rwby world. So

I have seen all of Rwby and don't know everything so I'm gonna step over real Canon lore.

I'm not good with power balancing in stuff.

A lot stuff my be understanding which you might see differently.

Feel free to call anything out you think could be better also I'm not asking to write anything if want to use my ideas I give you permission but I'm asking you to?

Without further ado let's talk about The Keep and it's Keeper.

Long ago when the brothers still wandered the Rement with their creations a women would follow and worship them. The women was mighty curious about the gods. She would flatter them, bring them gifts and talk about how the world was. Inreturn they would sparly talk of a relam they lived before. The women wonder if they were born their or if it was another world they made. As she grew old and Time neared its end she would build a magic mask to keep her memories and a piece of soul so her apprentice would have all the tools he needed.

As time pasted the mask would gather more soul pieces and memories. Soon a women named Salem would gather the armies of Humanity to fight the gods. The current holder of the mask thought she was insane with how much he knew of the gods.

So he gathered a small group of people and ran far away from the battle and prayed for mercy. It is not know if the gods listen or were seemingly so egotistical that they missed the spot. With population they would try to reproduce but it was quickly show 2 generations they would end up inbreeding with how little they were. So the current holder tried to slice human and animal DNA to fix the problem and it worked.

But would one see humans came back so the host now called the Keeper would return and learn of Salem and Ozma using the relics he would learn Salem,Omza, and even the Ever After story and mangne to get a single leaf of the Tree. The next Keeper would become one of Salem's handmaidens. Which would go terribly so as the castle burned the Keeper would shove a child away causing the child to knock out but seen by someone else and saved.(A story for another time)

Salem and Omza were locked in battle so the Keeper would hide away. The Keep would soon develop fully as it's own entity. As magic started to die out the Keep and it's current Keeper were able to grow a small tree from the preserved leaf. Using the tree they were able to make a Potion that would awaken magic in people without magic but kill those unable to handle it. So the Keeper title would be passed down all the way to morden day always staying out of Ozpin and Salem sight even giving people Magic or making Magic tools to keep them of its tail.

I think that's enough for origin. Many of his actions will effect my Rwby world. Feel free to ask any questions or critique anything.

This sounds like a really interesting idea. I'm kinda curious to see where this story goes. Though I do have some questions about the story, too.

First off is the mask the Keeper wore, and how it would store the memories of the previous keeper, as well as their soul. Does the mask still do that? What happens when someone wear the mask? Does it ever come off?

Next is the topic of the inbreeding group who were able to solve their problem thanks to splicing animal DNA. How exactly did they do that, and were there any ramifications to the inbreeding?

Last is the tree growing in Remnant. Is it sentient? How is it decided whether or not a person is worthy? And if these people are granted magic, how are they kept out of sight by the rest of Remnant?

[aspiringwarriorlibrarian]

Team RWBY as also "bad protagonists" because they apparently don't affect the main plot or at least aren't constantly driving the main storyline forth at a nonstop pace. Yeah that also baffles me because "team RWBY don't affect the main plot" How? They are the main plot!

I think it's partly motivated by a mentality that they "don't do enough" or "don't do it correctly".

The kinds of things that Team RWBY tends to do are more about the value of small and partial victories, the resilience and healing needed to keep going in the face of relentless evil or failures by forming strong bonds with each other, and the willingness to lean on others and trust others to continue the fight when you've fallen down.

A running theme of most views like the original point was making seems to operate on the notion that the only valuable thing a protagonist should do is big, grandiose absolute victories that fix everything perfectly and put them as the big saviors whom all should respect and defer to.

In other words, a lot like how a lot of people seemed to think Adam and Ironwood would be.

But the series actively skewered and dissects this mentality, with those two being highlighted more and more overtime as being intensely self-righteous at best and downright monstrous because all they really care about is their own grandiose fantasies at the expense of others.

Hell, Ozpin, even if his own goals were better-intended, suffered from this issue for millennia, since his belief that he was the only one who could oppose Salem and fixation on the bigger picture meant that he constantly overlooked how his "perfect world order" was cracking and falling apart at the seams because of the numerous small failings and societal issues he considered to be less important than defeating Salem (whom was smart enough to recognize his bad habits and exploited it ruthlessly), and arguably to the point of overlooking the possibility that his entire quest set to him by his God was likely never intended to succeed in the first place, because his goal was fundamentally impossible.

RWBY is a story about the small victories, how they can inspire others to try their best, even if only a little bit, and how the little things can build and improve to truly enacting change, in ways that grandiose gestures and fixation on bigger glories can overlook, or outright actively harm. How much the small things we do to help others can snowball into bigger and more profound impacts because we as people remember to actually care about others, instead of seeing them as a stepping stone for "the main characters".

And more than anything, that justice and a better world is a living and breathing organism that needs to be cultivated and nurtured with care and compassion, acknowledging and addressing the warts and all of society and that the fight never ends no matter how much people might want a guaranteed "happily ever after". Not forced at gunpoint or by "purging the problems until they go away" by those who think everything should be solved by the egomaniacs with the biggest god complexes.

That's exactly it. This isn't a story where we find a giant superweapon or where we have a series of battles where some win and some lose. Salem is immortal, infinitely patient, and the game is rigged against them. The only way to win is to change the fundamental narrative of Remnant itself. It's a story about broadening your understanding, learning to get back up, accepting yourself. Which often leads to cool battles, yes, because the demons of human nature here occasionally have the form of literal demons you can shoot in the face.

[bhu98]

The way my heart broke when these things happened in ep 8 and why i feel its important:

1. Ruby killing Oscar: a bit biased bc I love rosegarden. But honestly speaking it's bc of how similar they are. They're both the youngest of their friend groups with a huge amount of responsibility on their shoulders. I think this was significant bc Ruby does feel some type of way about him, whether it's kinship, responsibility, friendship or romantic. Based on the context, I'm assuming responsible as that's what the whole scene was about.

2. The close up on Yang when Ruby drank the poison: as an older sister who also had to take care of her younger sister and grew up with her, I would be absolutely devastated if my sister did that in front of me. The amount of confusion, guilt and regret I know Yang is going to feel next episode is something I look forward to seeing RT executing.

3. Ruby fucking dying: need I say more?

4. Jaune failing to save another person: Not sure if this is gonna hurt him as much since it was Neo, but this was yet another life that he failed to protect. He was so close and yet, he couldn't succeed. I would also like to see more of his frustration with that concept, but right now I doubt it since there's a lot RT need to go over.

5. The cat going inside Neo: I screamed her name out of concern bc Neo didn't give a fuck about Salem, or the survival of the world, she just wanted her friend back. So yeah, she was out for revenge and once she got it, the sense of emptiness, loss and hopelessness was all that was left. Before she could even think about her next move, if there was one, that damn cat possessed her. This is another biased opinion bc I love Neo, she's that gray character that was pushed too far and was Ruby's worst nightmare bc of it. Like imagine if she had kept blaming Cinder instead? Would she be a good guy? Definitely not. Her problem solving is to get rid of the problem and then there won't be one. Would she be a major inconvenience towards Salem and crew? Of fucking course. And God I just need Neo to be given another chance and be like, fuck those other guys, then be the tank RWBY and everyone never knew they needed. Anyways, that's it for my rant!

[nancyd-yeahyouknowme]

It’s me yo girl… jk I don’t think anyone follows me but it’s okay I’m just vibing and typing out my Nancy Drew thoughts bc THE NEW GAME IS COMINGGGGGGG! I’m so exciteeeeeed. They just posted more shit on Instagram/FB, I’m living for it, and I’m p high. So yeah, anyway…I was thinking about how I’m especially looking forward to Nancy Drew and the Mystery of the Seven Keys (sidenote: wonder what the acronym is going to be?!?!? MSK? MYS? KEY?)bc I LOVE the ND storylines in general. Even the games that I really don’t fucks with and play as often (I’m looking especially at you, CRY, RAN, and MED), I still love clicking through most of the conversations, playing out the little side missions/mini games, and just exploring the overall gamescape. So…

Even if KEY (I’m going with that for myself for now) is as horrible to play as MID was, it will (hopefully!!!) still have a good storyline and fun little tasks and random phone calls … all of those classic ND things that make all the difference. Like… even with MID, I really did love the Johnny cake thing or whatever, and it was kinda cool to explore “Salem” and learn some history. I also LOVED the herbs task. But, of course, HATE HATE HATE the non-point-and-click… I can’t even put into words whatever the fuck MID used to move around! I am sure there is a word for it, but frankly, I don’t care to use it. I hated it. 0/10. Still hate it. But, again, I know I’ll go back to it SOMEDAY bc I get in just the right mood… all bc of that storyline and the characters … and the herbs!!!!! But back to KEY…

The Czech Republic?!?!?!? I cannot WAIT to see more of the environment. I am SO EXCITED to find out how/why ND finds herself there. And, of course, I’m looking forward to playing the coffee (I think???) mini-game that HER keeps teasing!!!

I’m also LOVING the clues that HER keeps posting. That energy is really great and so appreciated! And, special shout-out to all of the fucking smart ass mofos out there who keep solving their little hints and clues and puzzles (which are all HARD AF, in my humble opinion) and then posting them for lazy ppl like me!!!! I love a good walkthrough, love all of the helping hands… I do really TRY to solve a lot of puzzles myself, but when it comes to the more difficult ones (especially these clues that HER keeps posting! Like damn!), I usually need some assistance, lol.

Welp… anyway, that’s all she wrote. Peace

[onewomancitadel]

If Knightfall weren't to materialize in canon, yet Cinder still ends the series redeemed, would you feel it was more of a missed opportunity for a potentially interesting development or a bungle on the part of the writers?

Now this is a good ask, thank you! It's a very interesting question because I essentially predicate my theorising about Cinder's redemption upon Knightfall; if Knightfall weren't to materialise, would that sort of make her redemption arc... accidental? The storytelling less precise? The Ozlem less of a big deal? Would it still be able to precipitate Salem's? When you've got all of these moving parts what as a reader you're trying to divine - you must wonder what it looks like for the storyteller - you really can't read any of these elements separately.

I've mentioned a few times that what I struggle with when it comes to the very little Cinder redemption speculation I've seen - which doesn't necessarily include her living, so her happy ending is not always prioritised but moreso her service to other characters - is that it's sort of just so. It happens because it needs to. It happens because she's sympathetic. It happens because they like her. It happens because Ruby figures out what's going on with Cinder's arm - without asking how Cinder would feel about the purification, of course, particularly if she herself has not put all the parts together yet... how do you get either of them to see each other as more than faceless enemy? What I really like about the Knightfall dynamic is that it is putting a face to an enemy - before even any real empathy emerges or... more complicated relationship.

So that informs how I read her redemption arc because I think Cinder's actually a very, very tough nut to crack, and it's why I find her so interesting. Her redemption arc is meant to be a tough nut to crack - so you either have people not really sure what it's going to look like, people convinced the Power of Friendship has already failed her and anyway Emerald got her shit out so Cinder doesn't matter (what about Mercury...), or people who think the idea of her redemption arc is flagrantly ridiculous, either because they like the idea of a cackling villain who stays evil because that's more interesting or because they hate her.

I'm mostly trying to convey that I don't really ship Knightfall because it's arbitrary. It's the ballerina en pointe on a knife's edge. It's the clincher that holds it together and makes it intelligible.

So if Knightfall didn't materialise I would assume the storytelling is not as thoughtful as it was. That's all. I wouldn't just read it as a missed opportunity, I would read the allusions uninteresting, the Ozlem conflict not fully solved and certainly not fully mythic... and Cinder's redemption arc was never really that special, it just had to be paused until Ruby or Emerald or whomever wizened up or Cinder learnt her lesson. There was no need to write Jaune in any particular way, it would make him accessory - unless they DID involve him with no romance and that wouldn't just be COWARDLY, it would be STUPID and a complete BUNGLE and wouldn't realise the mythic magic of the story or the romance or, you know, character boon on either side. Why the fuck would I settle for platonic love for Cinder? Sorry, friends are great, but this girl grew up desperately unloved and absolutely no one's priority. Heal that or fuck off and die.

I'm not pulling the related character arcs out of thin air - this is already a thing all over the show - and I think that Emerald/Mercury is going to be a romantic redemption arc/enemies-to-lovers - so there's no reason to act like Knightfall is exceptional. if R/WBY is coherent, Knightfall is a thing. If R/WBY is incoherent and less interesting, Knightfall is not a thing. That is pretty much the way I see it. There's a lot more than Emerald/Mercury paralleling it but I wanted a very specific similar archetypical example. You can see the twin pairs related across redemption arcs through the story (which lead them to reconciling/connecting ot others). I use the word coherent as opposed to clever because I'm establishing that this isn't difficult: it simply needs to make sense. It doesn't need to be perfect. It just needs to use intuitive narrative language and basic storytelling tools and that's it. That's what you predicate Knightfall on.

Really no Knightfall wouldn't just be a loss to Cinder's character but Jaune's, because I have no fucking clue what they'd do with him otherwise. I'm being genuine, I sincerely don't know, and I think it's why he doesn't make sense to so many people because they can't read him in response to Cinder and it's just not obvious to them. It certainly depends how they play the Penny angle - but there's no reason to make him do that and connect him to Cinder again unless you have something interesting cooking.

I've encountered this idea with previous pairings before that involved redemption arcs that platonic love between the two characters could be just as interesting. I'm sorry but that's just obtuse. We know it's not the same thing. We know a romance would convey a different message (particularly if it's Ozlem in reverse and fixed) and we know that there are other powerful friendships in the series that this isn't something we're exactly starving for. There is no way you can expect a major relationship between Jaune and Cinder to just be platonic. Of course I'm banking on a happy ending, or something approximating it - tinged with loss but still happy - because otherwise the story should've ended with Salem's loss. I really can't see it as tragic love either as the big transcendent send-off for the story that heals all mythic wounds.

So either R/WBY is coherent and thoughtful or it isn't. Knightfall happens or it doesn't. I'm being completely serious, I genuinely don't think there's any way to otherwise write Cinder's redemption arc as the precipitator to the ultimate narrative resolution or even if he's involved there's almost no way to do it without romance. You either answer the questions posed by the narrative or not. We know what those questions are now, we just don't know what the answer is.

It can always go tits up but I really don't care. I'd rather be invested now and do damage assessment after the fact than wonder if it would've been worth speculating about Knightfall. If Cinder's redemption is tied up in all the ideas I think are interesting about the show and so is Knightfall, then yes, I wouldn't like it if it didn't happen, but I can't be blamed for listening to my storytelling instincts. It's not about being right or wrong, it's about feeling something.

[bookaddict24-7]

REVIEWS OF THE WEEK!

Books I’ve read so far in 2022!

Friend me on Goodreads here to follow my more up to date reading journey for the year!

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251. Cycle of the Werewolf by Stephen King--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

I absolutely devoured this book. Although you can tell that this is a product of the time (mainly by certain derogatory words that King uses), the story feels timeless. I also think that this is the perfect read for October. The artwork, the atmosphere, and that build up of terror is definitely going to keep you up at night.

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252. Just A Bit Obsessed by Alessandra Hazard--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

Re-Read in October 2022: This is the one I was most excited to re-read in the early books of this series. I love how certain events in this book happened because the actions of the woman in this felt very petty. Definitely made me feel giddy as I re-read!

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253. Two Truths & A Lie by April Henry--⭐️⭐️⭐️

I usually enjoy YA thrillers because they're fun and there isn't a lot of thought processing behind it because of their predictability (save for a few I've encountered in the past), and this one wasn't any different. While it was fun, it wasn't mind blowing. I had my suspicions over who was the killer and what some of the twists would be, so it wasn't entirely surprising. But with all of that being said, it was still an entertaining read and would make for a great cozy murder mystery by the fireplace as the weather gets colder. I don't have a fireplace, but the image just sounds nice. Will this blow your mind? No. But it might just entertain you!

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254. Nick & Charlie by Alice Oseman--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

I LOVE MY BOYS. Even if they sometimes lack communication and let their insecurities get the better of them. I loved that this had Oseman's classic art throughout the book. I love these two so much and like one of the characters said, if there was an example of what soulmates look like, it would be them. Please read Heartstopper before you read this!

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255. Two Degrees by Alan Gratz--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

This was the second book I've read by this author and I am convinced that I need to read all of his books. I loved this novel and what it could represent, AND that it is aimed for the younger generations (anyone of any generation SHOULD read this). Just like in the last book I read by Gratz, this one tells three separate stories that eventually come together into a great overarching narrative. What I love about this is that it makes me want to connect the dots before the epilogue and try to guess how these characters might know each other. I think each story carries its own important message in regards to the climate change currently happening, how people are reacting (or not reacting) to our changing world, and the aftermath of the consequences of our actions. Gratz doesn't hold back when it comes to giving us the jarring reality of the situations these characters face, including the casualties that occur during these events. I also found it so terrifying how the hurricane story mirrors what just recently happened in Florida. That timing was just...wow. I highly recommend this book and I think it should be taught in schools. Our world is changing and I'm glad to have another book that explores the topic.

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256. Spells for Lost Things by Jenna Evans Welch--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

I received a copy via the publisher because I interviewed the author on Indigo's Instagram page. This did not affect my review in any way. Much like the MC of this book, reading her story was like taking a trip into the whimsical world of family and Salem. I enjoyed getting to know more about this witchy family and their cursed history. I also loved how the male MC learned to trust and love those who offer him a home and felt for him as he faced some of the darker realities of his situation. I adored watching the two of them fall for each other as they tried to solve the mystery at the heart of this book, and how they helped each other find themselves. This was just such a sweet read about family and magic and I think if you want a good October read that won't give you nightmares, then this might be perfect for you! The atmosphere and setting is great for those who love realistic fiction with a touch of the otherworldly, and the humour will make you want to wish you were a part of this family. I didn't make this a five star rating because it took me a bit to get into the story but once the mystery started, I was hooked.

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257. Nowhere Girl by Cheryl Diamond--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

The moment I heard about this book, I absolutely wanted to read it. This was so heavy, but so good. I couldn't stop listening to it--even through the darker moments. I think that if you're thinking of reading this, definitely check for trigger warnings. Diamond had such an incredibly rough life leading up to this book's publication. I think she put the perspective of the situation (from the POV of an outsider) best herself when she shared the POV of a man in her life: how her childhood is so fascinating, but it's easy to think that when you're not the one living it. She lived with an abusive father, siblings, and a mother who fell more and more into herself. Despite the heartbreak and the moments where my heart dropped for her, I am so glad I read this and I would recommend it to anyone who is looking for incredibly hard hitting memoirs that don't shy away from the dark realities of some families.

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258. How Moon Fuentez Fell in Love with the Universe by Raquel Vasquez Gilliland--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

The fact that this book was on my shelves for years hurts my heart because IT WAS SO GOOD. I was so surprised and hooked from the beginning! Gilliland deals with some heavy topics in this, but I love that these topics were explored (especially because we are seeing more and more fatphobia in society). I think this book will help anyone who thinks they are alone in hating their bodies, or thinking that the insults thrown their way makes up who they are. Moon struggles with her self-image and the way others see her because she has always been compared to her "perfect" twin sister. I think exploring these topics will help (even if they can be triggering) because it will hopefully help the reader feel less alone. Don't even get me started on Moon's love interest. I loved how their romance flourished and that this was a classic enemies to lovers romance trope, intermingled with some pretty bugs. Her love interest was such a cinnamon roll and I'm so happy that they found each other. However, you can see their ages in how they react to certain situations (even though Moon is more mature in other situations.) Also, this book is definitely for the older teen (and up). Keep that in mind if you're recommending it to anyone younger than fifteen or sixteen. Please read the trigger warnings for this book!

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259. Every Summer After by Carley Fortune--⭐️⭐️⭐️

I finally read this one after it was so popular during the summer. I can see why, though. This has summer written all over it (especially because of the title and cover.) I enjoyed this and I loved that it was set so close to home (for me). I liked seeing how the relationship between the MC and the brothers was slowly developed through flashbacks. I wasn’t a big fan of one of the big twists and how the love interests acted at various times (although I understand too because they’re so young). Not going to lie though, I’m team older bro. Sorry not sorry. One of the main reasons why this isn’t higher rated for me is because while everyone hyped this up, I just kept thinking of the other romance novels that used this same theme and storyline. I know there’s no true original ideas anymore (for the most part, save for the few instances) but I mean, this was still not as good as other novels I’ve read with a similar storyline. Would I recommend this to others? Of course! It’s a great summer read and if you haven’t read the books I’m thinking of, then I think you will love this.

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260. The Ghosts of Thorwald Place by Helen Power--⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️

I was NOT expecting to enjoy this book as much as I did. There was something about it that just kept pulling me in when I wasn’t listening to it. Also, a Toronto setting? Heck yeah. This building made me think of the Ice towers in the city. The mystery was fun and the twist was unexpected. I mainly loved this book for the voyeuristic storyline of this ghost watching these lives continue—no matter how chaotic. It shows that we truly never know what a person is doing behind closed doors. This was also surprisingly terrifying. I wasn’t expecting to feel moments of discomfort (despite the topic and genre of the book). There are various scenes that are definitely nightmare inducing. Perfect for October tbh. If you want a thriller/horror novel with compelling characters and a unique perspective on what it might be like to be a ghost stuck where you were murdered, then you might enjoy this one. But read it with the lights on.

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Have you read any of these books? Would you recommend them?

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Happy reading!

[alyssalikestoreadbooks]

Spells Trouble - P.C. Cast and Kristin Cast

"Double double, twins spell trouble…

Hunter and Mercy Goode are twin witches, direct descendants of the founder of their town of Goodeville. As their ancestors have done before them, it is now time for the twins to learn what it means to be Gatekeepers–the protectors of the Gates to different underworlds, ancient portals between their world and realms where mythology rules and nightmares come to life.

When their mother becomes the first victim in a string of murders, the devastated sisters vow to avenge her death. But it will take more than magic to rein in the ancient mythological monsters who’ve infected their peaceful town.

Now Hunter and Mercy must come together and accept their destiny or risk being separated for good."

Read Date - October 2024

Length - 320 pages

Genre - Mythology, Fantasy, LGBTQ+

Rating - 7/10

Stars - ★★★★☆

Notes - The start of the book showing off that their witches is super cool. This is my first fantasy book i’ve ever read so i’m really new to this all, and i like how it’s introducing it through Salem, and loosely, the Salem witch trials. It’s so cool to me. The dynamic between Hunter and Mercy is so interesting. They’re twins, but they’re having some issues with each other. Nothing major, just small things like not liking each others partners. The party scene was a great introduction to all the people and friends in the twins lives. I liked it. The ritual scene was also a good introduction to the world, and gave us back story to what happened after the prologue. The ritual going wrong was a shock and i liked how it was handled. The death of their mother, abigail, likely by the wolf is such a poignant scene i wasn’t expecting this early on in the book. Their mother being ripped away is a big deal for them, as they’re still young witches who need their mother, and also to be taught. The reveal that Xena can transform into a human to take over this mentorship role is so cool. Human Familiars are such an interesting plot line. It all reminds me of Charmed. The twins friends being there for them turning their time of grief was super sweet, and i liked how they were there for them. The spell they do to remove Mercy’s grief is so cool, and i like how all the friends got involved. Chapter 13 being about the sheriff, and his past life, is also really neat. I love all the murder-mystery elements, and i think it was played out so well. The reveal that the person who died was Emily, the twins friends, dad. The girls helping her grieve in return was nice. The spice between Kirk and Mercy was different, and i wasn’t that into it. It was trauma sex and she needed something to forget about the pain. Kirk being there for her though was nice, it would’ve just been nice if he could understand why it was happening. The twins working to fix the trees is a bit confusing and takes up a lot of time, but i know it’ll come together in the end. It generally shows off the girls and their witchy abilities! Perfect for the halloween season. Mercy having doubts about Hunter’s God is interesting, and a cool plot point that i never considered when first picking up this book. The conversation through the realm is so fucking cool. I like that they get to talk to other people from different realms, like the demigod. There’s so much happening, and I don’t want people to think I’m not following, it’s just very hard to review this one IN the moment the way i do. There’s so many interweaving plot points playing with each other, and i can see how they all end, and i cant choose just one to focus on. The God Instead Of Goddess situation with the twins is going to be a big deal, and it keeps rearing it heads up again and again without being resolved, so i know there’s going to be conflict. The Kirk situation has to be solved eventually, whether she leaves him or not is undecided. The person/thing who’s killing people in goodville is still on the loose, and the girls are obviously NOT safe. If their mom was killed, they can be as well. It’s a big issue. And then there’s the conversation with the Demigod, and the reveal that the girls shouldn’t be the only two guarding FIVE realm doors. It’s all so much happening at once. The twins having to kill the monster is so insane to me. They’re just teenagers! I love that the twins leave behind remembrance to the native americans who helped the witches through the years in their spell. Jax revealing that Kirk is an absolute dick was another shock! I wasn’t expecting him to guilt trip her, and have a “meltdown” only to reveal that he was stringing her along the entire time. The borderline abuse was such a shock. He’s such a piece of shit and i hate him. In the end, Mercy and Hunter are able to convince emily’s parents to let her do the ritual, and she helps them out instead of kirk. Something goes wrong with the ritual, at the end, and Mercy can’t get in contact with Hunter. The fight scene with Polyphemus and Hunter was SO COOL and it gave me anxiety and it was so perfect! I loved it! I bet there’s a sequel to this book because honestly the ending was really flat and kind of left off on a cliffhanger, and I don’t know if i’m interested enough to seek out the sequel myself. 

[deancodedinthewater]

Scarecrow Part 2

Dean walked down the main road, looking around as he did. This place put a lot of small towns he’d been in to shame. Small, quaint little place. Just like the other two identical small towns he had just passed through.

Ahead of him there was a cafe. Scotty’s Cafe written on the sign. Sat on a chair, on the porch of the cafe, was a man and Dean walked right up to him. “Let me guess,” Dean said, feigning nonchalance despite how much he wanted to just be quiet. “Scotty?” He gestured to the sign and then to the man.

“Sharp one you are,” said Scotty.

“Hi, my name’s John Bonham,” Dean said, sticking a hand out to shake.

Scotty raised a sceptical eyebrow at him, ignoring the proffered hand. “Isn’t that the drummer for Led Zeppelin?”

Awkwardly, Dean took his hand back. “Wow,” he said, not expecting to be called out so soon. “Good. Classic rock fan.” There was an awkward pause in which Dean didn’t know what to do. He wasn’t going to take back the alias but then what does he do now?

Fortunately, Scotty solved the problem for him. “What can I do for you, John?” Dean took his cue and pulled out the missing persons flyers for Holly and Vince from his inside pocket.

“I was wondering if you had seen these people by chance,” he said as he handed the flyers to Scotty. Scotty scrutinised them for a moment before he lifted that eyebrow back to Dean.

“Nope,” he said. “Who are they?”

“Friends of mine,” Dean lied easily. “They went missing about a year ago, passed through somewhere around here. I’ve already asked around Scottsburg and Salem-”

“Sorry,” Scotty said, shoving the flyers back at Dean. “We don’t get many strangers around here.” Dean nodded, though something about this place was making him uncomfortable. That small town mindset, maybe? Whatever it was had his hunting instincts telling him to stick around a little longer.

“Scotty, you’ve got a smile that lights up a room, anybody tell you that?” Scotty frowned at him. Dean chuckled awkwardly. So, flirting his way into the information he needed wasn’t going to work. Time to move on to someone else. “Nevermind,” he said as he started to walk away. “See you around, Scotty.”

-

Sam shuffled his bag further onto his shoulder as he trudged along the edge of the highway. It had been a couple hours since he had left Dean and the sun, which had barely been up when he started walking, was beating down on him. He stopped, contemplating hitching a ride. Not like he hadn’t done that before.

Just off the road he spotted a girl, about his age. She had short, blonde hair - it was slightly shorter than his own - and earbuds in. Presumably listening to some kind of music as she bobbed her head along.

“Hey,” Sam said as he slowly came up behind her. She didn’t respond. So just like Dean, she listened to her music too loudly. Sam gently tapped her shoulder. She jumped to her feet with a startled gasp.

“You scared the hell outta me,” she said, pulling her headphones out.

“I’m sorry,” Sam said, taking a step away. “I just thought you might want some help.”

“No,” she said. “I’m good, thanks.”

“So, where are you headed?” Sam asked, hoping for some small talk to pass the time.

“No offence,” the girl said, giving him an unimpressed look. “But no way I’m telling you that.”

“Why not?”

“You could be some kind of freak,” she said with a shrug, tucking her hands into the pockets on her jacket along with her earbuds. “I mean, you are hitchhiking.”

Sam laughed. “Well, so are you.” The girl laughed too. Sam started to ask for her name as a van honked behind him. They both turned to the road as a white van pulled up and the driver leant over the passenger seat towards them.

“Need a ride?” he asked.

“Yeah,” Sam and the girl said together.

“Just her,” the driver said, with a sneer on his face. The girl dropped to the ground to gather her things. “I ain’t takin’ you.” Sam scoffed but didn’t argue. The driver popped the door open and the girl climbed in.

“You trust shady van guy and not me?” Sam asked, attempting to raise just one eyebrow and certain he just looked stupid.

The girl looked at him with a smile as she pulled the door shut. “Definitely.” They drove off and Sam stood and watched for a while before he continued to trudge along the road. Maybe someone else would pass soon and he could get a ride.

-

This little town had a General Store with a gas station and Dean had taken a gamble that this might be his best bet. Though the husband and wife that ran the place were more talkative than Scotty, they didn’t have any more information for him than Scotty had.

“You sure they didn’t stop for gas or something?” he asked, holding the pictures out one more time.

Mr Jorgeson took them and held them out for his wife. “Nope,” he said, frowning down at the posters. “Don’t remember ‘em. You said they were friends of yours?”

“That’s right,” Dean confirmed, holding his hand out for the posters back as a teenage girl made her way down the stairs, carrying a stack of boxes. She caught sight of the pictures as Mr Jorgeson passed them back.

“Did the guy have a tattoo?” she asked, scowling at the pictures.

“Yes, he did.” The girl set her boxes down on a nearby counter and came over to them. She took the poster for Vince out of Dean’s hand and her scowl deepened. Dean fought the urge to smile. He might be finally getting somewhere with this.

“You remember them right?” she said to the older couple. “They were just married.” For a brief moment Dean thought he saw something - anger, annoyance, frustration - cross over Mr Jorgeson’s face before it cleared and a look of recognition took its place.

“You’re right,” he said, looking at the picture of Vince again. “They did stop for gas. Weren’t here more than ten minutes.”

“You remember anything else?” Dean asked, hopeful.

Mr Jorgeson thought for a moment. “I told ‘em how to get back to the Interstate and they left town,” he said, finally.

“Could you point me in that same direction?”

“Sure.”

-

Dean wasn’t all that great at following directions. He’d get lost somewhere between step 1 and step 2. Follow the road for this long and turn- and he was gone. His brain just could not retain the information. This time though, he did his absolutely level best to stay the course he had been told. He drove along Orchard Road, following the directions he had been given when something started to beep in his bag.

“What the hell?” he asked aloud. He pulled over and reached into his bag, searching for whatever it was that was beeping. It turned out to be his EMF meter, frantically beeping and all the lights lit up. Dean frowned at it and then looked out into the orchard around him. Something was here. He didn’t stop the smile this time.

As he wandered the orchard, Dean kept an eye on the EMF. Whenever it dropped he would stand still and turn in a circle until he found the strongest signal again. Once he found it, he started moving. A scarecrow a ways in caught his eye and Dean approached it. He stared up at it for a moment, noting the haphazard stitching and sloppy patchwork that covered it.

“Dude, you’re fugly,” he said to it. The EMF was going crazy. Dean glanced down at it and as he did the sickle in the scarecrow’s hand caught his eye. It looked far too shiny to be something they just left out all the time. Then he saw it. On the scarecrow’s arm was a familiar looking design. Dean glanced around and spotted a free standing step ladder over by a nearby tree. He grabbed it and dragged it over to the scarecrow.

Once he was up the ladder he pulled out the flyer for Vince and held it up to the scarecrow’s arm. “Nice tat,” he said, glancing up at its face. Yeah, this was definitely the right place. He made his way back to the road and did a U turn to go back into town.

Pulling up at one of the pumps at the local gas station, the one he had been at earlier, Dean got out.

“You’re back,” the same teenager that had recognised Vince’s tattoo said, a note of shock in her voice.

“Never left,” Dean told her, shoving a hand in his pocket as he made his way around the car.

“Still looking for your friends?”

Dean nodded. He spotted a nameplate necklace hanging from the girl's neck - Emily. “You mind filling her up there, Emily?” he asked, gesturing to the car. She nodded and grabbed a pump. Dean leant against the back of the car next to her as she started to fill the tank. “So, you grew up here?”

Emily glanced up at him. “I came here when I was 13,” she answered easily. “I lost my parents - car accident.” She gestured over her shoulder to the convenience store. “My aunt and uncle took me in.”

“They’re nice people.”

“Everybody’s nice here.”

“So what it’s the-” Dean rolled his hand as he spoke, searching for the words. “-perfect little town?” Emily laughed.

“Well, you know, it’s the boonies,” she said. “But I love it. I mean, the towns around us, people are losing their homes, their farms. But here?” She waved her free hand towards the town as a whole. “It’s almost like we’re blessed.”

Dean nodded, more sure than ever that something was going down in this strange little town. “Hey,” he said after a beat of silence. He turned towards Emily, resting his hip against the car. “You been out to the orchard? You seen that scarecrow?”

“Yeah, it creeps me out.” Dean laughed at that answer as Emily stood, lifting the pump from the car.

“Whose is it?”

“I don’t know,” Emily said, shrugging. “It’s just always been there.”

Over her shoulder Dean spotted a red van parked by the garage. He nodded towards it and Emily turned to see. “That your aunt and uncle’s?”

“Customer,” she said as she turned back to him. “Had some car troubles.”

“It’s not a couple is it?” Dean asked, hoping she would say no. “A guy and a girl?” he added, he wasn’t sure if a gay couple would trigger this thing. Emily hummed  a yes and Dean frowned. That was worrying.

-

Sam was practically dead on his feet by the time he had hitched far enough to get to a bus station. He stumbled up to the window and asked the clerk when the next bus was.

“Sorry, the Sacramento bus doesn’t run again till tomorrow,” she said, checking the schedule as she spoke. “At 5:05pm.”

“Tomorrow?” Sam asked, incredulous. He leant back, away from the counter, and ran a hand down his face. “There’s got to be another way.”

“Well, there is,” the clerk said, tapping her hands on the counter. “Buy a car.” She moved away from the window as Sam turned away. He was ringing the strap of his bag between his hands as he looked around.

Sam grabbed his phone and pulled up Dean’s contact. He was about to hit call when a voice interrupted him. “Hey,” it said and Sam looked around, turning his phone off as he did.

“Hey,” he said to the girl from that morning.

“You again,” she replied from her pile of bags on the floor.

“What happened to your ride?”

“You were right,” she admitted, leaning back on her hands. “That guy was shady. He was all hands.” Sam raised his eyebrows, his jaw unclenching in surprise. “I cut him loose.” Sam looked away, unsure how to respond. The tension in his jaw immediately returned and the girl leant forwards, resting her elbows on her crossed legs. “What’s the matter?”

“Just trying to get to California,” Sam said, avoiding the question.

“No way!” the girl exclaimed. Sam frowned at her. “Me too.” She stood from her bags and walked over to him and Sam noted just how small she was compared to him. “You know, the next bus isn’t till tomorrow.”

“Yeah. Yeah,” Sam said. “That’s the problem.”

“Why?” She asked, tilting her head as she looked up at him. “What’s in Cali that’s so important?”

“Just-” Sam considered what to say. He couldn’t tell her the truth, obviously, but what would be believable?” Just something I’ve been looking for. For a long time.”

“Well, then I’m sure it can wait one more day, right?” Sam laughed at that and the girl stuck her hand out to shake. “I’m Meg.”

Sam shook her hand. “Sam.”

-

Dean pushed the door to Scotty’s open and waved to the man himself, where he was presumably serving the couple of the moment. “Oh, hey, Scotty. Can I get a coffee, black?” Dean asked as he made his way over to a table near the couple. Scotty made a face at him but moved away to go see to his order. “Oh, and some of that pie, too, while you’re at it.” He sat down at the table just behind the couple and smiled at them. “How ya doin’?” he asked with a smile and they waved at him, smiling in return. “Just passing through?”

“Road trip,” the girl said.

Dean hummed an acknowledgement, nodding. “Yeah, me too.” They nodded and turned back to their table. Scotty came over and filled their drinks. He then gave Dean the stink eye.

“I’m sure these people want to eat in peace.”

“Just a little friendly conversation,” Dean said, raising his hands defensively. Scotty walked away, grumbling. “Oh, and that coffee, too, man. Thanks.” Scotty shot him a dirty look and Dean turned back to the couple. “So, what brings you to town?”

The girl turned back to him with a polite smile. She was attractive, so was he. If he was looking to be a random couple's unicorn, these two wouldn’t be that bad. He shook that thought from his head. Maybe another time. “We just stopped for gas,” she said. “And the guy at the gas station saved our lives.”

Dean cocked an eyebrow at her, focused back onto the case now. “Is that right?”

“Yeah, one of our brake lines was leaking,” the guy explained. He reached across their table and took his partner’s (wife’s?) hand. “We had no idea. He was fixing it for us.”

“Nice people,” Dean said, trying to keep his suspicions out of his voice. The guy nodded and Dean’s knowledge of cars, everything Bobby and his Dad taught him, started whirring around in his head. “So, how long till you’re up and running?”

“Sundown.”

Sirens started going off in Dean’s head. “Really? To fix a brake line?” He asked, halfway to incredulous. He leant forwards at his own table. “My uncle taught me a thing or two about cars and that don’t seem right. Let me have a crack at it and I’ll have you up and running in about an hour.” They hesitated. “Won’t even charge you for it.”

“You know, thanks a lot,” said the girl. “But I think we’d rather have a mechanic do it.”

“Sure. I know,” Dean said, pretending that didn’t sting. He’d probably be able to give these bozos a full brake overhaul before sundown. ‘Rather have a mechanic do it’. Fuck that. Dean was a better mechanic than anyone who couldn’t fix a brake line in an hour. “You know, it’s just these roads. They’re not real safe at night.” The couple shared a look and Dean realised he had fucked up.

“I’m sorry?”

He was too deep in it to backpedal now. “I know, it sounds strange, but-” he glanced at Scotty who was nowhere to be seen. “-you might be in danger.”

The man smacked a hand on his table and turned to Dean. “Look,” he snapped. “We’re just trying to eat, okay?”

“Yeah,” Dean said and then he started rambling. He wasn’t even sure what he was saying. Something about Sam. He had to keep this conversation going until he could get them to agree to let him fix their van. Or- or something. Anything that’ll get them out of this town before sundown.

The bell above the door jingled jovially. Dean and the couple glanced over. Scotty came out of the back. “Thanks for coming, Sheriff,” he greeted the newcomer. And Dean knew exactly why the sheriff had been called. He glanced back at the couple, more annoyed than anything else. Worried for them.

Scotty whispered something to the Sheriff and then they both looked right at Dean. Dean looked away. The Sheriff came over and tapped his fingers on Dean’s table. “I’d like a word, please.”

“Come on,” Dean complained, rubbing his fingers through his hair. His ring caught in the short strands and tugged uncomfortably. “I’m having a bad day already.”

“You know what could make it worse?” Dean nodded. He followed the Sheriff outside and then got a police escort out of town. Which just made him think maybe the whole town was in on this thing.

-

Meg had dragged him to a table and made him drop his bag as she dumped her own. She disappeared into the crowds and returned with her arms full of food and beer. Sam laughed as she nearly dropped the lot before she reached the table. He caught the beers for her.

“Nice catch,” Meg said as she sat down across from him and spread out her food haul.

“What’s all this?”

“I owe you one for warning me of that shady van guy,” she explained, gesturing to the food before picking up one of the beers and twisting the cap off.

“You still went with him,” Sam reminded her, picking up the other beer.

“Eh, details.” She waved a hand at him and started digging into the food. Sam followed her example.

After a moment of comfortable silence in which they both ate their first real meal of the day, Sam looked over at Meg. She threw a handful of fries, saltless as she was on a low sodium diet, into her mouth as she looked back at him. “So,” he started, awkwardly leaning back in his chair. “What? Are you on some kind of vacation or something?”

Meg laughed. “Yeah, right,” she said. “It’s all Cristal poolside for me.” Sam laughed with her then. “No,” Meg continued, her laughter stopping instantly. “No, I- I had to get away from my family.”

“Why?”

Meg sighed. She sipped her beer and then changed her mind and downed what was left. “I love my parents,” she said after a pause. Her eyes were on the floor but as she spoke they rose until she was staring right into Sam’s soul. “And all they ever wanted was the best for me. Their idea of what’s best for me is-” She set down the empty beer bottle and rubbed her hand over the bridge of her nose. “-different from my own ideas. They didn’t care that I didn’t want what they wanted. I was supposed to be smart. But not smart enough to scare away the boys.” Sam smiled sympathetically, unsure how else to respond. Meg kept talking. “It’s just... because my family said so, I was supposed to sit there and do what I was told. So I just went my own way instead.”

Sam stared at her. He couldn’t believe how similar her story was to his own. Well, minus the boys and plus some monsters. Although given their dad’s reaction to Dean’s bisexuality, Sam could guess if he was into boys it would be a somewhat worse situation.

“I’m sorry,” Meg said and Sam blinked at her, folding her arms over her chest as she leant away. “The things you say to people you hardly know.”

“No,” Sam said, a little too quickly. “No, it’s okay. I know how you feel.” Sam’s hand went, unbidden, to his pocket and gripped his phone tight. He could feel the plastic straining. “I have this brother. We’re - or we were - road-tripping. It’s kinda the same deal. My family wants me to do one thing but I want to do another. I had to get away.”

“And that’s why you’re not riding with him anymore?” Sam nodded his head. Meg raised her empty beer in a mock toast. “Here’s to us,” she said. “The food might be bad and the beds might be hard. But at least we’re living our own lives. And nobody else’s.” Sam tapped his bottle against hers and drank, Meg pretending to down hers.

-

Once his escort left him, Dean gave it a few more miles before pulling a U-turn and heading back towards Burkittsville. He kept an eye on the dwindling sunlight as he floored it. He knew he wasn’t going to get back to the town in time to stop the couple leaving but he could make it to that orchard before they got iced.

He hit the brakes hard when he saw the red van appear in the beam of his headlights. “Shit. Fuck,” he muttered to himself. The tires screeched as his Baby came to a dead stop. He eased off the brake and pulled in behind the van.

“Why do people never listen to me?” he grumbled as he pulled his gun out of the trunk and started running towards that scarecrow. When he reached it it was already off of its pole and Dean cursed again.

“Steve?” he heard the girl say and Dean ran faster.

“Who’s there?” the guy called out. One of them screamed and they both started running in his direction. Good. Save him the trouble of finding them again. They stumbled into him just as Dean readied his gun, all three of them stopped moving.

Dean looked behind them and cocked his gun. “Get back to your car,” he told them and they followed his gaze. The scarecrow was lumbering through the trees. 

“Go!” Dean yelled. “Go!”

He shot the scarecrow as the couple moved past him. It stumbled but kept shambling on. Dean shot it a second time as he started running. And again the scarecrow was barely affected. A third shot had the same effect. Dean kept on running. He caught up to the couple just as they broke the tree line and stumbled into the clearing. The scarecrow was nowhere to be seen.

“What-” Steve gasped as he tried to catch his breath. “What the hell was that?”

Dean spun around, his gun raised, keeping his eyes trained on the trees. “Don’t ask,” he said. “Just keep moving.”

Steve led his wife away. They didn’t run this time but Dean stayed ready. Once they reached their cars, Dean lowered his gun. He asked them what had happened. When Steve explained Dean went to get his tool kit out of his car. Jenny tried to insist they go back to town but Dean, and Steve, were having none of it.

“You go back there and this’ll all happen again,” he told them. “Just let me fix it and you be on your way. Find yourself a mechanic somewhere later. Just don’t go back to town.”

Reluctantly, they both agreed and Dean did his best to get their van moving in limited light and with limited tools. Dean pulled himself back out from under the van, with his flashlight wedged between his head and shoulder, and gave them the all clear. “It’ll hold decently,” he said.

“I’m sorry,” Jenny told him.

“Thank you,” Steve said.

“Just get out of here before it comes back,” Dean told them.

-

Sam sat up against the wall and held his phone to his ear. “Hello?”

“Sammy, sorry did I wake you?” Dean asked.

“No, no. I wasn’t sleeping.” Sam rubbed at his crusty eyes. Dean had absolutely woken him; he was just glad he hadn’t also woken Meg. She was curled around her bags only a few feet away. “What’s going on?”

“There is a case here, Sam,” Dean said and Sam was way too tired to try and decipher the tone of his brother’s voice. “I just witnessed the nightmare version of the Wizard of Oz.”

“What?” Sam was also too tired to understand that.

“I’m telling you Sam,” Dean continued. “It got off its cross and shambled around.”

“The scarecrow climber off its cross?”

“Yeah, Burkittsville, Indiana. Fun town.”

“It didn’t kill the couple, did it?” Sam asked.

“No,” Dean assured him. Sam dropped his head back against the wall. “I can’t cope without you, you know.”

Sam chose to ignore that comment. “So, something must be animating it,” he said, instead. “A spirit?”

“No, it’s more than a spirit.” Sam frowned. That didn’t sound like a good thing. “It’s a god. A Pagan god, anyway.”

Sam’s instincts were correct. Dealing with gods wasn’t good. “What makes you say that?”

Dean hummed, as if he hadn’t heard and Sam was halfway through reiterating his question when Dean answered. “The annual cycle of the killings,” he said. “And the fact that the victims are always a man and a woman. Like some kind of fertility ritual. And you should see the locals.” He laughed then and Sam got the feeling he was missing some kind of joke. “The way they treated the couple. Fattening them up like a christmas turkey.”

“The last meal,” Sam agreed. “Given to sacrificial victims.”

“Yeah,” Dean said and Sam could picture the way he nodded. “I’m thinking a ritual sacrifice to appease some Pagan god.”

“So,” Sam said, rubbing his face. He really was too tired for this conversation. “A god possesses the scarecrow...”

“And the scarecrow takes its sacrifice,” Dean finished. “And for another year this crazy little town gets to live out their lives. Crops won’t wilt and disease won’t spread.”

“Do you know which god?” Dean replied in the negative and Sam had to fight the urge to start doing research for the case. “Well, you figure out what it is, you can figure out how to kill it.”

“I know,” Dean said and Sam could hear the exaggerated eye roll. “I’m actually on my way to a local community college. Got an appointment with a professor there. You know, since I lost my sidekick geek boy. He used to do all the research for me.”

Sam laughed. “If that’s a hint you need my help you could’ve just asked.”

“I’m not hinting anything,” Dean replied. “Actually-” Dean paused here, stuttering over his words. “I want you to know- I mean, don’t think...”

“Yeah,” Sam said, cutting across Dean’s stumbling words. He knew when Dean was struggling to force his words out. “I’m sorry too.”

“Sam,” Dean said. His voice had gone raspy, the way it did when talking became a real struggle. “You were right.” Sam’s eyes widened, Dean admitting that was rare. “You gotta do your own thing. You gotta live your own life.”

Sam blinked. “Are you serious?” he asked, not even close to believing the words forcing their way out of his brother’s mouth.

“You’ve always known what you want,” Dean said. Sam heard the leather jacket move and squeak against the leather seats as Dean shrugged. “And you’ve always gone after it. Even if you had to stand up to Dad to get it. You’ve always done that.” The more Dean spoke the more firm his voice became until suddenly he was choking on his words again. “Hell, I wish I-” He stopped himself. Sam knew how that sentence would end and it felt like a kick in the teeth. He’d always looked up to Dean. Strived to be just like him. And now he was hearing that his big brother wanted to be more like him? It felt backwards. Wrong. 

“Anyway,” Dean continued. “I admire that about you. I’m proud of you, Sammy.”

“I-” Sam tried but his voice caught in his throat. He got what Dean meant about sandpaper. “I don’t even know what to say.”

“Just-” Dean paused. “Just say you’ll take care of yourself.”

“I will,” Sam promised.

“And call me when you find Dad.”

“Ok,” Sam said. Dean hung up. “Bye, Dean,” Sam finished to the dead line.

Meg stirred from her pile of bags and sluggishly pushed herself up. She stared at Sam with bleary eyes and took in the phone he was still holding. “Who was that?” she asked as she blinked the sleep from her eyes and stumbled over to Sam.

“My brother.”

“What’d he say?”

Sam dropped his hand to his side, still cupped around his phone, and shared a look with Meg. “Goodbye,” he answered and even he could hear the note of sadness in his voice.

Masterpost

[invested-in-your-future]

Honestly I find the maiden's powers to be completely boring and unimpressive compared to semblances

"Oh wow you are able to use ice powers that's reall- oh never mind there's an ice semblance that is ten times cooler (no pun intended)"

"Oh wow you have fire powers that's great and all but we already have a girl who can fire punch using her semblance so...."

And it's not even getting into magic my god,similar to the maidens I am easily unimpressed at the magic in this show since again it's just semblances but with a different coat of paint

If I had to rewrite this then I will make the maiden's powers be a boost to someone's semblance thus getting them stronger as a result (depending of which season),and as for magic I will have it as some kind of spell that everyone uses using a spell book (before humanity was wiped from existence and semblances began to rise),I don't know if they're good but what do you think?

Yeah, I think the issue is that the show never really bothers to commit to the idea at all.

The first showcase with Amber is still the most impressive showcase of Maidens to date. NINE volumes in. Raven versus Cinder was flashy but it didn't convey that this is two limitless beings clashing at all.

Here's this idea about four beings being granted basically limitless power. How did that start? How does it work? What are implications on the world as a whole that beings like that existed through history? How does existence of four extremely powerful superweapons impact the world politically? Why would revealing them go badly according to Glynda? The show doesn't answer OR care.

Generally, when introducing something on this scope, narrative would attempt to hype it up, to establish just how different from "normal" limited things like dust and semblance it is - if something is introduced, the story has to add weight to the concept so it feels like a part of the setting by impacting everything else.

But they can't - because there are Relics now - every bit that would hype up Maidens as this limitless force would in turn make Relics feel less. Not to mention the narrative wants the audience to fear Salem and to think that relics are dangerous and important and with three Maidens being on the "good" side, making them strong in turn makes the threat less.

So the show ends up with a situation where majority of Maiden presence is Cinder being an absolute clown. And then the winter maiden is treated as a hot potato - rather than the force to be reckoned with people (and plot itself) care more about who ends up having it.

And then the magic is very loosely defined too - what is it? what makes it different from the rest of absurd powers that come via use of Dust and Semblances? The answer is simple - in the show, magic is whatever the writers want it to be for convenience - that includes being a device for an insta-flashback or a tool to insta-know a plot-thread without writers having to write a natural way for characters to learn it. Need to create four Maidens? Ozpin, uhhhh, did magic things! The nature and rules of Magic have no clear answer or explanation in the show, because it is treated as the answer instead. It's why Relic "rules" are treated like "guidelines" too.

Honestly I am kind of amazed at how much just would get solved by just dumping the two gods subplot into trash. By dumping all of that, there's a whole lot more room to make Maidens actually a thing that makes sense.

The way I am handling it is that I want to build up and establish how it all works and why it's even there - including what was Ozpin's role in the whole Maiden thing and why Maiden's exist too.

One of the first things I did when planning was to think up what "Magic" means in this setting. Then I wrote down for myself specific rules that should apply to semblance and dust, but not magic/maidens, as well as another set of rules that should apply to specifically only Maidens.

[prophctic]

annika sat down, running a hand through her hair. it was a lot to take it, but growing up in the supernatural world, at the very least, meant she and everyone else here was good at rolling with the punches. biting her lip, she tried to make sense of everything jo was telling them.

"it sounds like it was the dread doctors," she agreed, "but jo is right; if sebastian is dead, if the original dread doctors are dead, then...what are they even doing anymore?"

"and who are they? if the original dread doctors are dead, and sebastian is dead..." sam frowned. "you said they were an evolving organism, jo. does that mean that there were always more of them, over the years?"

"you said people thought the beast of gevudan was the original werewolf for a long time," ivy said, eyes focused on the space ahead of her, darting slightly as she thought. despite all she had been through, all they had all been through, in the last day and a half, she felt herself almost relishing in having a new mystery to solve. not that she was happy that they were in more than one form of supernatural peril; rather, if she thought about this, it meant she didn't have to think about salem. not to mention this seemed almost more dangerous; after all, the coven didn't know where they were, at least not yet, but the dread doctors apparently knew exactly where uche and her siblings were. "but they were wrong," she continued, looking up at everyone. "ife was the original werewolf. what if people are wrong about when the dread doctors originated, too?"

"you think they could have been around a lot longer than the 1700s," sam said, looking over at ivy.

"it's possible, isn't it? how long have hunters been around?" she asked. "were the argents the first?"

"i've heard about them going back to the beast of gevudan, but not before. but...their family had to be around since before then, right?" annika inquired.

"and these dread doctors, they're not supernatural, and they're not quite hunters, either, right? some hunters are...well, pretty exclusively that, aren't they? they kill indiscriminately. others, like you guys, and allison, you're trained to know how to defend yourselves against supernatural attacks, but you don't hunt people just for being supernatural. you work with the supernatural, help them; you're helping keep anyone from getting hurt. but the dread doctors sound like they're...i don't know. on their own side." Ivy frowned thoughtfully. "they obviously don't care about keeping people safe if they're kidnapping people, kidnapping kids, and doing experiments on them. how do we know they even really cared about sebastian? i mean, it says he was their friend, but...what if he was another one of their experiments? what if they've been doing things like this for a really long time, longer than people have even known they existed? you said they could make people forget they had even seen them, didn't you? so what if they made people forget they existed before? what if there were always more of them than just the ones from gevudan, and it's always been bigger than sebastian?"

"it would explain why they would be here now, and why they would target uche. or at least, it would start to," sam said. "ivy brings up a good point. in early civilizations, there were already hunters; not hunters of the supernatural, but people who hunted for food, or protected their families from danger."

"that there were," ajani agreed. "and you are right; humans have worked with and against the supernatural since the beginning. some found marvel and mysticism in our existence, some wanted to work alongside us or even join us, still others feared us and because of that fear, wanted to be rid of us. and of course, not all supernaturals have always been kind to humans. much like la bete, some do harm others, and need to be stopped. i would sadly not be at all surprised if these dread doctors sprang up far earlier than texts may state, perhaps in response to fear, or curiosity, or both. they may very well have been around far longer than we realize."

"so the ones allison and her pack killed, those were just...a faction of them?" willow asked faintly.

"it may be so," ajani said sadly.

"how did they attack here in new orleans, though? i thought this was a sanctuary city?" gemma asked nervously, hands wringing together.

"it is, and you are safe here," ajani assured her. "allow me to explain. a sanctuary city means you cannot be extradited elsewhere, though of course, any crimes you commit here you will be held accountable for. not you, of course; i speak broadly for any who visit this place. likewise, you are contained safely here from any who seek to harm you; you cannot be tracked once you are within the confines of new orleans. but people can come here all the same, and though there are laws in place that state they cannot attack, some still do. those who do are dealt with, but attacks do happen. and if i understand what joanna is saying, these dread doctors are traveling along electronic currents, similar to those conducted by the nemeton. if that is the case, they would have had an easy entry into this city."

jo snapped to attention when they addressed her. "right," she said, stepping further into the room. she sank to her knees in front of the coffee table and pulled a few books out of her bag. two of them were clearly journals, worn with use; the last was a novel, titled the dread doctors, with the eerie cover art that one would expect from a late 80s scifi book. "like i said over the phone, they're called the dread doctors."

"someone wrote a book about them?" claire asked, leaning forward to take the book.

"don't open it," jo hurriedly warned. as if burned, claire dropped the book back to the table. jo winced. "sorry, that was abrupt. allow me to explain." she picked up one of the leatherbound journals and held it up for a moment. "back in the mid-1700s, there existed a providence in france called gevaudan and within that province, there was a wolf."

"la bête du gévaudan," damaris muttered. "the first infamous werewolf in recorded history. what about him?"

"in the hour of la bête's reign, there were rumors circulating about who he was and what connections he had. he was eventually taken out by the family that started the legend of silver being harmful to supernaturals: the argents. prior to that, however," she continued, "it was rumored that he had friends. and when marie-jeanne argent killed the wolf, sebastian valet, these friends sought to bring him back to life."

"like eshe did with her siblings," lux pointed out.

jo nodded. "yes. except these friends weren't supernatural; they were strictly human. at the time, however," she said, picking up the second journal, "there was a massive wave of scientific breakthroughs and interests. so where these friends lacked magic, they had science. so they tried bringing him back to life through science, but that didn't work. they were close, though. however, time passed, they grew older and sebastian's body decayed. this was in a time long before humans learned the proper ways to preserve bodies, so there was nothing they could do about it. they faced two problems then: the natural process of decomposition and their own mortality.

"the leader of the doctors, the original, his name was marcel. over decades of time, he managed to master the art of blatant pseudoscience and learned how to manipulate electromagnetic forces."

ife straightened up at that. "the electric residue," she recalled. "julia said there was electric residue left over when they disappeared."

"and i believe that," jo said. "what marcel and his fellow scientists did was figure out a way to exist within those electromagnetic forces, thus outside of the flow of time that we know. so when i say that they're human, they very much are. there is nothing supernatural about them."

dean pursed his lips. "but i don't get it. what does uche have to do with sebastian? and it's the twenty-first century; they haven't given up on bringing him back to life yet?"

"i'm getting there," jo reassured him. "but knowing how they got this way is important to understand how we got here."

dean nodded and gestured for her to continue.

"once they figured out how to keep themselves alive, they returned to their original goal of bringing sebastian back," jo continued. "but so much time had passed that he no longer had a body. so they needed a host. over time, they mastered the art of transferring one person's spirit into another body, but that wasn't easy. sebastian wasn't just another person, he was a wolf; he was the most terrifying beast that had ever existed in france. a lot of people in this day and age think he was the first werewolf in existence. the people of gevaudan certainly thought so. that's where the book comes in," she said, setting down the journals and picking up the book. "it's all but a detailed memoir of their experiments."

uche frowned. "experiments?"

here, jo hesitated. she opened her mouth, then closed it. she set the book down and freed up her hands to gesture as she spoke. "the scientists, dubbed the dread doctors by the author of this book, realized that the only people who could possibly handle a spirit like sebastian's were people like himself: supernaturals. but it was nearly impossible to find werewolves that could be taken down by humans and withstand the strength of sebastian's spirit. so they thought that maybe the answer was in people who had untapped genes, like someone who was born into a werewolf family, but that lycanthropy gene was recessive, so they were functionally human. but those people still turned out to be too fragile for their experiments and all of them died... except for one. jeon haetae was a korean teenager back in the late 1850s, and he was the first person to survive what the doctors were doing. he was human, but his mother came from a line of werewolves, so he did, too." she paused and bit her lower lip. "but haetae's father came from a line of fae."

the revelation came to uche dully, like a soft punch to the chest. she blinked. "he was a hybrid."

"genetically, yes," jo confirmed. "he still died, a few weeks into their experiments, but he survived far longer than anyone had thus far. so the doctors began experimenting on people like him, other hybrids. they found people who came from two lines of supernaturals but were humans themselves."

"is that why they targeted my sister?" ife questioned, holding uche tighter. "because she is a hybrid?"

jo considered the question for a moment. "in theory, i believe that would work. despite not being human, uche is the original hybrid; if anyone could handle sebastian with ease, it's her. but i don't think that's what happened here."

julia frowned. "why not? it makes sense, doesn't it?"

"in theory," jo repeated calmly. "but the dread doctors... after jeon haetae died, they realized that adults only last for so long. since the 1850s, the dread doctors have only ever experimented on young children. most of them still died pretty early, but those who didn't could last a few years; often years that they doctors wouldn't have had with adults."

"christ," dean swore beneath his breath.

claire eyed the book carefully. she wanted to read for herself what had happened, despite how horrifying it all sounded. "why can't we read it?"

"remember when i said that marcel mastered pseudoscience?" jo recalled. "his particular brand was memory science. the dread doctors learned how to manipulate the memory of anyone who came across them. in the past, this was used primarily against parents who'd seen their child being taken, back before the doctors found a different method of kidnapping them. but years ago, a decade, i think, the dread doctors' victims escaped."

harry's eyebrows lifted in surprise. "they escaped? how?"

jo shook her head. "i don't know. there were only a few of them left alive at that point, but they managed to get away. so to protect themselves, the dread doctors erased those kids' memories of them, even from afar. but the thing about lost memories is that their return can be triggered, so..."

claire blinked. "the people who escaped wouldn't know that they'd been held captive and experimented on... until this book forced them to relive it?"

jo smiled, though it looked saddened. "essentially, yes. to my knowledge, some of those escapees remembered what'd happened to them even before they found this book, but for most of them, it was a violent awakening. and once they read it, the doctors found them again."

interest in the book firmly lost, claire shuddered, wrapping her arms around herself and stepping closer to her father.

"how do you know all of this?" dean asked. "you didn't tell us anything about it."

"because i didn't experience any of this for myself," jo said. "my family, the harvelles, are offshoots of the argent family. allison, the current head of the california argents, is my distant cousin. we haven't had much contact over the years, because the argents operate differently than the harvelles, but i did get in contact with her about a year ago. she's a part of a pack out there⎯⎯and according to her, that pack killed the dread doctors almost two years ago."

lux furrowed her eyebrows. "if they killed them, then..."

"the dread doctors are an evolving organism," jo clarified. "there have been multiple variations of them over the years, so it stands to reason that allison might have killed the previous generation and another sprung up. the thing is that there is no reason to. because, as far as allison has told me, the doctors succeeded in bringing back sebastian, and the pack killed him, too, in a way that can't be reversed. so if uche was attacked by the dread doctors, and it really sounds like she was, then they are acting in a way that i can't make sense of. for all intents and purposes, their god is dead and they have no reason to exist anymore."

[waheelawhisperer]

To be somewhat fair to ironwood and fria he was clearly still giving her medical attention and keeling her as safe as he could which given she seemingly had dementia makes some sense, letting her wander around the city probably wouldn’t have been idea

But keeling her completely isolated from anyone except winter and whoever offered medical attention was still cruel,

Yeah, for me the issue here is less so that Ironwood provided Fria with end-of-life care so much as the reasoning behind it. He's not caring for a feeble old woman in her final days out of the goodness of his heart (or at least not just out of the goodness of his heart; Ironwood is most certainly capable of kindness, but that isn't the primary factor in play here), he's doing it so that his handpicked candidate has ready access to the powers of the Winter Maiden.

Given that Fria is... definitely not all there, I definitely don't think she should be allowed to wander around unchecked with the powers of a fully realized Maiden, but the way the scene is framed doesn't raise this point and focuses on Ironwood keeping Fria contained because he wants to be able to transfer her power to the person of his choosing, rather than because she might pose a danger to others without full control of her faculties.

Nowhere are Ironwood's priorities with regards to Fria more clear than when he sends Winter to murder her for a strategic advantage. Make no mistake, what Ironwood ordered Winter to do was murder. Fria is not so much a person in Ironwood's calculus as she is a resource, and her life and agency become necessary sacrifices in pursuit of victory once Ironwood believes Atlas is sufficiently vulnerable.

This may be a controversial opinion, but Ironwood's decision was correct from a strategic standpoint, if poorly timed. Atlas needs every resource it can get to meet Salem's invasion, and there are few resources on Remnant more potent than a Maiden, especially when you consider the fact that you also gain access to the associated Relic. If employed correctly, the Relic of Creation could have been a massive boon to the war effort, despite its limitations. It could have been used to generate equipment, materiel, defenses, or even robotic reinforcements as needed. It can only do one of those at a time, but even that offers a level of flexibility the hidebound Atlesian military desperately needs to face Salem's forces, and Ironwood has enough troops to use the Staff as many times as he wants - and this is just the most basic, least creative use for the Staff I can think of!

Ironwood absolutely fucked up by sending Winter to claim the Maiden's power as soon as Cinder spooked him and not providing her with adequate cover, but he was absolutely right to try to establish control over the Maiden power from a strategic standpoint, because it expands his options significantly and opens up a number of new avenues by which to attack, defend, and retreat. Unfortunately, he was right kind of by accident, because he sends Winter to kill Fria because he's scared and wants to run from Salem, rather than because he's preparing to fight.

Moral implications aside, and there are a lot of them, I can't imagine that Winter "Solve Social Situations By Hitting Them" Schnee is particularly good at providing care to the elderly, and the scene where we're introduced to Fria heavily implies that Winter is the only one providing that care (because Ironwood can't risk the power going somewhere else).

I do think that Ironwood is genuinely trying to do the right thing and be a good person for most of his run on the show, in his own heavyhanded, hamfisted way, but when I look back on his actions and interactions in light of Volume 8, there's always this sense of "You aren't quite real to me, and I am prepared to sacrifice you (regretfully, perhaps, and maybe even with hesitation, but I will do it in the end) if it becomes necessary" to him. Still one of my favorite characters, though. I love how flawed and complex he is, and his voice and aesthetic are *chef's kiss*. Jason Rose did a wonderful job bringing the character to life.

[itsclydebitches]

The sad thing…I think Ruby already did “break”. In "Risk". When she snapped at the table. Yeah, it wasn’t much, but knowing RT and the FNDM, I feel that’ll be considered enough.

I think you might be right, anon. I just rewatched those scenes and honestly, the supposed work they did was just as flimsy the second time around.

First, Ruby begins the meeting by generally being pessimistic about their situation. Everyone else is worried, but they're working hard to keep their hope up. Yang asks what they're going to do now and Blake, though she lists all the challenges they have to overcome, doesn't follow it up with any negative conclusions. It's Ruby who says, "So then it's impossible." Their leader is shutting down the conversation, not just failing to come up with the next step, but actively discouraging everyone else from doing that work either. It's Emerald who points out that this is a problem in her own, Emerald way: "Ms. Hero with all the answers" suddenly doesn't have any to offer. Yet instead of helping Ruby to overcome her pessimism and lead their team again, the group succumbs to yelling at Emerald instead for, frankly, speaking a mean but very accurate truth. When Oscar says that they have to stop turning on each other, Ruby reveals she hasn't been listening. Her thoughts are still on the supposed impossibility of their problem. “Then nothing has changed! We’re in the exact same place we were yesterday!" and she runs from the room.

In a vacuum I don't think this scene is bad. It actually has a lot going for it. The floundering leader, the group turning on each other without anyone nurturing Blake and Yang's attempts at optimism, Oscar being the sole voice of reason... there's good stuff here. The problem is everything that comes after it and, admittedly, how our reading of the scene is colored by what came before.

Basically, Yang goes to comfort Ruby and they... don't talk about any of the issues Ruby is displaying in this scene. They mainly talk about Summer which is indeed a issue, but not a relevant one right now. If RT wanted a grimm!Summer subplot I really think they should have put that somewhere other than in the Volume when our Big Bad is attacking and a major ally goes Genocidal General. But even putting aside the amount of the conversation that's devoted to Summer rather than their current problems, Ruby goes on to say:

“I wasted our time getting Amity up, thinking help would come, but it didn’t and Amity fell. I was being childish."

Now, I think Ruby has indeed been very childish since Volume 6, but she wasn't childish here. The problem is she was passive.

Yes, Ruby Did A Thing by sneaking into Atlas HQ and helping to send that message, but she admits fully that this was primarily in an effort to get other people to come and solve this problem. Yang is the one who frames Amity as something that could potentially help people now that they've had a warning. Ruby frames it as a tool to get other people here to fix things. If Ruby's passiveness had been confined solely to trying to call in reinforcements and if calling those reinforcements made any sense, we'd be fine, but this is the arc where:

People need to evacuate due to the threat Salem poses and Ruby keeps a portion of the Kingdom from doing that.

She does this under the firm believe that she and her team will fix things somehow, despite not having any way to achieve that.

So she calls on other people to come and fix the currently not fixable situation. She calls more people to Atlas when the primary goal is to evacuate Atlas. Reinforcements, while generally a great strategy, change rather drastically when your opponent is immortal.

Help doesn't come because of course it doesn't. Ruby knows how few huntsmen any other Kingdom has. Ruby should know how far Atlas is from everyone else and that it's only been about a day. Common sense should tell her how seriously people are going to take a 17yo stranger talking about magic and immortal queens, yet Ruby is mad because "it didn't [come]." She's upset that other people didn't arrive to fix this despite it being staggeringly obvious why that didn't happen.

She sat out the biggest battle to date, explicitly commenting on how sad it was that others were dying while she rested in a mansion.

May told her to choose someone to help and Ruby wouldn't.

Harriet told her that Qrow was in custody, but Ruby made no plans to try and help him (something Blake says is now a lost cause).

She knew the rest of her team was missing, but sent May to find information instead.

When the team finally gets back together and asks, "What next?" Ruby throws up her hands, announces that it's impossible, and runs from the room.

The problem is not with Ruby having a (mini) breakdown, it's that this breakdown was about the supposed impossibility of their situation when Ruby hadn't tried anything yet. Up until this point, she's done nothing except deal with unexpected problems she's forced to tackle (Penny arrives, Hound arrives) and otherwise fosters the war onto others. Ruby doesn't need to come up with a plan after opposing Ironwood, she'll just call on the world to come and fix things instead. She doesn't need to choose someone to help because there are no sides and that magical solution will arrive with the army no Kingdom actually has. Any minute now. She doesn't need to try and find her Uncle, or her team, doesn't need to coordinate with Whitley when he thinks of using the airships, or come up with a way to help Nora, or go down to fight the grimm in Mantle, or speak to the man who has spent generations fighting this exact fight, or make use of her grimm-specific eye weapon... Ruby spends the Volume waiting for others to arrive with a fix that won't test her morals and when they don't, she crumbles. It's impossible. It's hopeless. And I'm like, Ruby, you're throwing in the towel before trying anything and you're doing that on top of seizing control of this moral dilemma in the first place.

There's a lot of character potential there. Frustrating to watch, but potential nonetheless. Problem is, no one forces Ruby to face it. Yang talks about how they had to take the "risk" (what risk?) and that her own "plan for Mantle didn’t work either," but "a lot more that wasn’t in the plan" did (what plan?). Yang acts as if the world truly failed by refusing to magically show up and fix things to her sister's liking, rather than the truth: Ruby failed by opposing Ironwood under the confidence of blind optimism — I'll surely find a better solution than the one that leaves half a Kingdom to potentially die — immediately failed to come up with that, offloaded the problem onto everyone else, staunchly refused to make any hard decisions, and then when others tried to come up with a single idea to improve the situation she announces that the whole thing is impossible. The Ruby in this moment needs a serious wake up call and then a hug.

But no one forces Ruby to confront her passiveness (or rather, May and Ren make an attempt before being told off). No one challenges her (wonderful) instinct to Do The Right Thing in a world that demands practical solutions. Ruby is not shown to owe her teammates any apologies for continually undermining their attempts to do something while she waits for that perfect solution to arrive. There's no growth here, just Ruby stewing in the supposed horror of other people not coming to her rescue, even though the viewer can easily see all the obvious, non-horrifying reasons why that happened. All of Ruby's actual difficulties — turning on her allies despite them all dealing with a terrifying trolley problem, refusing to help in small ways because it won't fix everything at once, ignoring the allies she still has and the civilians in danger to instead watch safely from afar, blaming this bad outcome on others' failure to show up and solve the problem she insisted on taking on, the hypocrisy that made all this worse by eroding the trust Ironwood had in her — are ignored because the writers knew they'd have her go, "Relic!" in a minute and then bam, Ambrosius lets them cheat their way to a solution. Why have your protagonist work through her failures and strive to do better when you can just have her 'remember' that she can do a version of a plan she opposed in the first place?

Sometimes I imagine a Volume 7 finale where Ruby balks at the idea of leaving half the Kingdom behind and, instead of gleefully attacking the Ace Ops, convinces Ironwood to use the Relic in a slightly different way. They can modify this idea to help everyone, she's sure of it, and yes, Ironwood might have more reason to put his faith in her — and the safety of his people — if Ruby hadn't been lying since she stepped foot in the Kingdom. A version of Ruby that owns up to her mistakes and commits herself to regaining Ironwood's trust in the name of unity, establishing herself as Salem's oppostite. Maybe she surrenders herself and we get a cool prison break where Ruby remembers that Qrow exists. Maybe she reaches out to Ozpin in an effort to discover whether they can use the Staff in a way that saves all of Atlas, not just the floating city. Where Ruby defends the people of Mantle with her silver eyes, or confronts Salem in the whale, or is coming up with short-term ideas for how to make things a little bit better. A story where "I don't like it when friends fight" leads to Penny being the bridge between Ruby and Ironwood's group, where Ironwood isn't randomly throw into the villain deep end, where the conflict revolves around all the heroes facing off against established villains as they struggle to evacuate everyone, keep the Relics safe, and keep the grimm from overrunning them all. A version of the story where Ruby can collapse under the weight of all this without me going, "Yeah, but... you demanded this responsibility. And then you didn't do anything with it. Of course this is hard, it would be staggeringly hard for anyone, but I'd feel a bit more sympathetic if this weren't largely a problem of your own making, compounded by you hoping others will solve the problem you explicitly took on."

So yeah :/ I think in RT's mind these scenes do constitutes a "break" that Ruby has now grown from. And yet...